Hi Gunnar,
IATB is a beloved institution in the nature blogging network, and I appreciate all the work it takes to keep it going. Mike, Charlie, and Corey have done a great job with it, giving us all a place to flaunt our written wares.

But perhaps the format IS a bit loose and all inclusive, rather than more selective and focused. Would a latter approach make reading/interacting less overwhelming and more useful?

I always envisioned a carnival as a series of posts from different authors relating to the SAME subject, or same THEME, at least. You know, a Macy's Thanksgiving Parade: first the big Turkey balloon, then the native American dancers, then the pilgrim floats, then the toddling ballerinas, then the Chinese acrobats and American Hip Hop artists. One parade, one theme. Many people and parts.

Instead, it seems the IATB host is challenged to create a theme out of disparate posts.

This is why I am guilty as charged as not yet hosting---the time it takes to pull off these lovely, creative hosting jobs we've seen this year is not trivial. IATB hosts have been darn good. I humbly crouch in their shadow.

Mechanically speaking, however, I like the idea of using an image and a tiny URL to make things retweetable.
.-= Laura´s last blog ..New iPhone App for Bird Watching/eBird Users =-.

By the way, dude, what plug in are you using to get this "Commenter's last post" functionality? Sweet!
.-= Laura´s last blog ..New iPhone App for Bird Watching/eBird Users =-.

I'm not here to shoot you, Gunnar, but I will explain why I won't adopt your suggestions for I and the Bird anytime soon. IATB is all about INCLUSION. The phenomenon of limited clickthrough is hardly limited to the bird blog carnival; in fact, I'd warrant that participants in most carnivals in the nature and science niches have observed the same diminished traffic.

However, what I and the Bird does have is an international community of passionate nature writers. We have history. We have accomplishment. We have a collected body of work that speaks volumes about the unbelievable quality of content many birding blogs are turning out.

What we've tried to avoid all these years is insularity or stratification. I reject the idea that any of us should stand in judgment of the work of our peers or further that a contributor to IATB should feel judged. IATB represents an opportunity for any bird bloggers to reach a wider audience. Readers vote for their favorite posts with their links, stumbles, tweets, and what not.

And Laura (when are we going birding, by the way?) all the posts are on the same topics: birding and wild birds. How much more specific do you want? I'd love to see a host ask for only waterfowl or raptor posts for a specific edition, but that level of coordination is up to the host.

I wonder, Gunnar, if you don't have the wrong expectations of IATB. As someone who has been a part of a lot of blog carnivals, I can point to solid, long-term advantages obtained from active participation. I'm sure that many of the IATB regulars would be happy to share their own thoughts on the matter. But anyone who expects torrents of traffic from a blog carnival in 2009 is bound to be disappointed.
.-= Mike´s last blog ..Where Are You Birding This First Weekend of December 2009? =-.

I have to agree with Mike on this one.

Further, I have only hosted I and the Bird once but let me assure you I got more hits on that post than any other I've every posted. I've had thousands of a hits from that post and I don't even get that many visitors. I average about 30 - 35 a day. Almost a year later, I have people linking from my IATB post every single day. And I'll tell you why: creative theme with a great headline. Searchability is all about the headline.

If one right, a hosted IATB post certainly can drive a lot of people to your blog.

I think we also need to remember that there are many different types of bird bloggers out there. There are a large number of people who spend time blogging about their yard birds and other local birds. This may surprise you, but a lot of these people have very dedicated audiences. So, it's possible that their posts may not interest you. Or maybe the guy who writes about a rarity chase in another country may not interest you either. But these things are of interest to others, I'm sure.
.-= Patrick´s last blog ..A gull of the Ivory variety =-.

Mike, Tim, and Patrick have already made my points specifically about the carnival, and much more eloquently than I could.

Gunnar, not every one blogs to get hits. There are lots of reasons to blog, and lots of skill levels. There are lots of ways to build community, and sometimes knowledge, personality, or genuine kindness stands a blogger in better stead than all the flashy, SEO-optimized titles in the world.
.-= Wren´s last blog ..Rollin’ on the River … Skywatch =-.

I think I tend to agree with Gunnar. Mike says, "IATB represents an opportunity for any bird bloggers to reach a wider audience." By definition, that implies hits. If they only get 5 hits, or even 50, how many are new readers? How many end up being regular readers? Chances would be greatly increased, I think, if there were fewer posts for people to scan through -- say 10 or 15 of the best submitted. But I'd suggest that in order to get new blogs in the mix, a certain percentage would be reserved for the best of the new blogs to the network, or blogs that have only been started within the last 6 months, or whatever.

Themes would also increase readership, and a pre-announced theme would likely limit the number of posts, solving that problem (hosts could still reserve a percentage for newbies). While there might be times I wouldn't read IATB if the topic were "Gulls" I'd probably read every post in the "Warbler" theme.

Looks like now the person who benefits most is the host.
.-= Julie´s last blog ..RRBO bird banding video =-.

Gunnar, this is a very interesting discussion, and I enjoyed reading all the comments as well.

Maybe we can start moving towards theme-based IATBs?

I too would hate to see exclusion and selection, though. IATB (as I see it, anyway!) is a carnival, a celebration, a feeling of community, and we really dont need or want the competition and ill-feeling that comes with a selection process.

And as the hosting moves around the world, so too does the focus, so thats fine I think!

Mike and all

Fair enough, I am not here to tear down an institution with such continuous history as the IATB. As a relatively new active blogger, Tim's contribution was the first I came in contact with, and I was impressed with what I saw. I wanted to be part of this. But realizing that there was such small click-through rates, made me wonder if there was not something that could be done to make the IATB more interesting for the participants and the visitors to the hosting site.
Patrick, I am well aware that backyard birders and those reporting from their local patches have been very good at getting a large community and constant readership. The point is, and which you touch, that there are different kind of readers of different blogs and with some editions of IATB having more than 30 contributions it gets diluted - and less interesting for whatever your interest as a birder is.
So maybe the hosts could be more specific in the guide-lines what kind of posts to submit? Ask for posts that fit the profile of the hosting blog. Maybe the contributors could make a more thorough study of the blog he/she contributes to and make sure he/she lends the best blogpost for the site?
Maybe the host could have an editors choice on top, where the selected pieces of the host gets highlighted? All the other contributions could be as I suggest in a "part two", or maybe better and abiding Mike's total inclusion dogma, lower down on the same post.
I think IATB could/should provide tremendous value to the readers of birding blogs. The host of IATB now is saying "I have read 30 blogs listed below about birds - what about you?", when he could say: "I have read 30 blogs about birds all which are listed below, and while they all are great, the first five (or 10) I have asigned as my favorites ."
Instead of just listing blogs with a cunning theme, the opinion of the host who have read all these 30 blogs, would matter and help his usual readers to discover some blogs that he has enjoyed. This way IATB would be more useful both for the regular reader of the hosting blog, as well as for the participants, who not only are part of the blogger community, but also have a chance of getting a recommendation from the hosting blogger.

I am being simplistic and pragmatic, and what it comes down to is that I am not able to write such smart threads (at least not in English) as I have seen examples of earlier this year.

A blog carnival that did send some visitors to my site was this from inspiring travel.
Simple and visual. Inviting to click further.

.-= Gunnar Engblom´s last blog ..blog =-.

I think you make a couple good point, Gunnar, but I don't think instituting hard and fast rules for carnival inclusion and hosting benefits the community in the long run.

The host is absolutely entitled to encourage themes or incorporate tweetable aspects and photos if they so chose, but requiring those aspects limits the creativity of the host and contributors. One of the reasons IATB, and carnivals in general, are so appealing is the occasional really funny or creative theme that makes reading the carnival itself exciting. Those tend to be my favorite, and keep me and other contributing in the hopes of being included in something like that. It would be a shame to handcuff the people who volunteer their time and effort, and I think could eventually lead to a lack of enthusiasm for the carnival, which is part of what makes IATB, in particular, so successful after 100+ editions when other carnivals fall by the wayside.

See Gunnar - I would never have met you without IATB! (I didn't even know that's how you found me). And having met you is worth more than a 1000 click throughs!

I followed your link to the blog carnival that you recommended and was immediately impressed with its layout and use of photos and then suddenly realized that the photo I was looking at was mine!!! I love this small world we weave through!!! And that my two short weeks in the Amazon continues to live on an on through the blogworld!
.-= TR´s last blog ..Photo of the Day: Taking Refuge - Cambodia =-.

I largely agree with Mike's approach to I and the Bird. Themed carnivals are perhaps more interesting to read, but I haven't noticed significantly better click-through from those than from themeless carnivals. The same goes for carnivals where the number of entries is limited.

I would say that the host can make a difference by writing better pitches for each of the entries, but that can be a challenge for some posts. When I host a carnival, I try to group together posts that have similar themes and give them headings. So backyard birders go together, rarity chasers, scientific research, etc. That way people interested in specific topics can find them easily. I also try to bump the better posts towards the top, as much as I can.

I do like the fact that hosts have a great deal of discretion for how they handle a carnival. It may result in some boring editions, but it also leaves room for some great ones.
.-= John´s last blog ..Pines in a Row =-.

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